Subject: Re: Free Speech on a.r.s. vs. Orders from Ron Newman From: David Mayo Date: 1996/05/12 Message-Id: <4n61a8$pba@light.lightlink.com> Sender: electra@light.lightlink.com Organization: Art Matrix - Lightlink Electra Gateway v2.4 Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- On Sat, 11 May 1996 22:19:22 -0700, Freewolf wrote: >Steve Fishman wrote: > >> >> Flo Barnett died unnecessarily after being audited in their Little Shop >> of Horrors. What do you call it, compassion? Love? Afterlife >> afterthoughts? > >Steve, a lady died. The same lady had been audited by Julie Mayo. You can >not directly connect the two. > >In another of your posts you made it clear that you feel the Mayos are >culpable for not directing her to the "actual" treatment she needed for >being a "manic-depressive." >Imagine one Scientologist telling another, "I think you're associating >your keyed-out state with your manic state and you should see a >psychiatrist to have this treated." > >Not that such a statement would ever occur between two scieno's, but what >if it did? Do you think Flo would've gone to a psych if it were >suggested? Of course not. > >You could be totally right that she failed to get proper treatment for a >treatable disorder which led to her committing suicide. If so, her >religious beliefs clearly contra-indicated psychiatric treatment. That >was her right. She was ultimately responsible for her actions and >decisions. This is all theoretical and is based on the premise that she did not get or was not advised to get treatment because we or she did not believe in it. That premise is not true. She was having medical treatment. When I supervised cases when I was in Scientology(tm) I was fastidiously conscientious about having people go to doctors for needed medical treatment. True, I would not have sent a Scientologist to a psychiatrist at that time but since I did send people to doctors, had the doctor thought there was a need, the doctor could have made such recommendation or referral. Even when I audited Hubbard in late 1978 when he was ill there was a medical doctor in attendance 24 hours a day. Earlier, when I either audited or CSed Hubbard when he was ill he went to hospital for treatment (e.g., Curacao, N.A.). After I left Scientology(tm) and in the AAC I continued to be as fastidious about referring people to doctors if there was anything wrong with them. Nor have I ever promised to cure or suggested that I could cure medical conditions, nor led anyone to believe that I might. I do know that there have been Scientologists and Freezoners who have thought that "it was all in the mind" in re illness and other matters and have acted that way. There are certain Christian religions such as the Jehovah's Witnesses and there are "New Age" practices also who act this way. I do not act in that manner though I will not deny that there are occasions when I am convinced that mental or spiritual techniques were far more causal in a physical recovery than other treatment. None of this was really relevant in this thread because the person concerned was treated at a medical facility, (UCLA) was under a doctor's care and was on prescribed medication. [...] > >[my 4 cents.] >Sir Freewolf >KOF, FBI Rev. David Mayo "So many have fallen, yet so far left to go ... " (finger for key) PGP ID: 1024/4D5EE559 1996/01/04 PGP Fingerprint: 0D 69 92 87 79 2F 38 72 FE 03 CE 51 31 D5 6D E9 ***************************************************************** -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBMZZpl+mCyCdNXuVZAQHVXAP/QgA3fXu7/omfyxHd1DUtYBpDzM8gpPz4 O18FqOXnYKbJy6+9gRt34EA7LFZe6/R0VjzHpON8Ryb4YxU0sCrexiXn2FGZ8cPA ZozT4uzoc94j/3EZJDaHqaq+wNpPpf87OddYm2OxKjKFlsIR+i1o00KixSiw49zU ftPiYPZz3l0= =jwgI -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----